Sarmatians armed with clubs?

[nikgaukroger]

context is important Anthony / Erpingham, and despite many images being available publicly it's hard (unless someone out there really knows this column and its images) to find the context from which the likes of this drawing (in an Alamy image) of a Germanic warrior with club was taken.

Resource on Trajan's Column - https://www.trajans-column.org/

Includes sequential pictures which may be the sort of thing you are after 

[Imperial Dave]

Most graciously received 

[Erpingham]

I am no student of Roman art, sculpture or literature, but often these are our only depiction of Rome's soldiers (or enemies) from such artefacts.

So the original sculpture of Trajan's column undoubtedly had a message other than just literal and pictorial representation; and those depicted may never have been seen by those creating the work. However its a key pictorial source that was intended to display Trajan's martial success and those he fought.

cliche perhaps fails to relate to any evidence as a statement.

The Romans in art and literature were prone to stereotypical descriptions and images of non-Romans, especially assorted "barbarians". We can call these references motifs, topoi or cliches (I'm afraid I find it hard to distinguish between a topos and a cliché). I think the general view of the sculptors of Trajan's column is they weren't working from something they'd seen but from supplied standard images. The club armed types are a pretty stock image of a Germanic barbarian, though their use of oval shields is perhaps unusual. This doesn't mean these types weren't present but we should be careful with interpretation.

This analysis of the types of figure on the column is interesting

https://arts.st-andrews.ac.uk/trajans-column/the-project/the-human-figure-types/

There are several sets of images online of the column (or the casts thereof) which show the clubmen in action. But I think that the Sarmatians are shown fighting the Roman cavalry, not the infantry. But this isn't my specialist area - one for the Romanists.

[stevenneate]

For some reason I have it in my head that there is a description of some Sarmatians being armed with clubs. I know that there is a reference to Palestinian clubmen but I think there is also one that applies to Sarmatians.

Any ideas?

I think it's a misreading of Pliny the Younger who said that Sarmatians loved to go clubbing. The bars and clubs of Sarmizegetusa's underground scene really rocked in the 80s (AD).  Pliny the Elder, on the other hand, disapproved of the Sarmatians' loud modern music and wild night life.

There you have it, easy error to make, but it was the 80s!

[Imperial Dave]

 

[Erpingham]

it's hard (unless someone out there really knows this column and its images) to find the context from which the likes of this drawing (in an Alamy image) of a Germanic warrior with club was taken.

I have looked and the Alamy image derives from Scene XXIV.

https://www.trajans-column.org/?flagallery=trajans-column-scenes-xxii-xlv-22-45#PhotoSwipe1766498180197

The subject of his ire is a fallen (apparently wounded) Dacian infantryman. We might note that this warrior has a sword as well as a club, which rather undermines my "iron poor" theory. Note also the way his shield attaches to his arm. Suggests that the sculptor wasn't familiar with functional details of shields.

[kodiakblair]

I think the general view of the sculptors of Trajan's column is they weren't working from something they'd seen but from supplied standard images.

Unfortunately wargamers latch on to those stock images and apply them to troops 1000's of miles and 100's of years apart.

Bee in my bonnet being the Celtic "naked " fanatic.

The Dying Gaul is a wonderful propaganda piece, triumph over the noble savage; done in the Greek heroic tradition hence the subject is nude. The artist's or patron's message is clear "look how powerful we are to defeat such a mighty foe". Then there's Polybius, he tells us the Gaesatae at Telamon fought starkers while the Boii and Insubres merely stripped to the waist. Siculus repeats the naked gaesatae claim but with him it may only be the leaders.

" 8 all in the prime of life, and finely built men, and all in the leading companies richly adorned with gold torques and armlets."

Next time the Gaesatae appear it's 3 years later at Clastidium. No talk of fighting naked there, hot topic was Marcellus defeating the Gaesatae leader Viridomarus in single combat then stripping the corpse of it's "fine armour" as an offering to Jupiter. Sounds like lesson had been learned since Telamon 

Telamon aside, naked in military terms just means unarmoured yet bands of naked fanatics seem to appear in every Celtic wargames army from Ankara to Aberdeen 

I shall refrain from airing my thoughts on Ancient Britons getting Woad seeds brought from Central Europe so they could cultivate a crop then give themselves skin burns trying to use the juice as tattoo ink     

[Imperial Dave]

I shall refrain from airing my thoughts on Ancient Britons getting Woad seeds brought from Central Europe so they could cultivate a crop then give themselves skin burns trying to use the juice as tattoo ink     

Especially the nether regions