SoA Forum

History => Ancient and Medieval History => Topic started by: Erpingham on Oct 15, 2022, 01:48 PM

Title: That's one in the eye for Harold (or is it?)
Post by: Erpingham on Oct 15, 2022, 01:48 PM
Here's an entertaining little dash (https://www.medievalists.net/2022/10/arrow-king-harold-eye/) through the sources about the arrow in the eye story by revisionist battle historian Michael Livingston.   I won't ruin the conclusion, as his narrative works like a whodunnit and, like many a detective story, you have to decide if you are satisfied with the denouement.     I find it classic Livingston - excellent case weakened by a wild leap or two and a bit too much certainty in his conclusion.  See what you think.
Title: Re: That's one in the eye for Harold (or is it?)
Post by: Imperial Dave on Oct 15, 2022, 04:41 PM
very interesting article and I have never been an eye supporter  :)
Title: Re: That's one in the eye for Harold (or is it?)
Post by: Cantabrigian on Oct 17, 2022, 03:11 PM
The author clearly doesn't understand how probability works, but appart from that it's interesting.
Title: Re: That's one in the eye for Harold (or is it?)
Post by: Erpingham on Oct 17, 2022, 03:24 PM
I think one of the issues is the distinction between whether the Tapestry showed an arrow in somebody's eye or not and the separate matter of the origin of the story that Harold was shot in the head/eye.  If the Tapestry didn't show the arrow, how did the story arise?  Would English historians have mixed up the two Harald/Harolds?  An Italian writer, perhaps.  But would he be more likely to have heard a Scandinavian account or a Norman one? 
Title: Re: That's one in the eye for Harold (or is it?)
Post by: DavidMcCann on Nov 05, 2022, 12:33 PM
If you look at the tapestry, you will see a caption "Hic Haroldus rex interfectus est" — "here king Harold is killed". Under "Haroldus" is a man with an arrow in the eye. But a contemporary source (William of Poitiers, if I remember correctly) says that Harold was cut down with a sword and that is depicted under "interfectus est".
Title: Re: That's one in the eye for Harold (or is it?)
Post by: Erpingham on Nov 05, 2022, 12:55 PM
Quote from: DavidMcCann on Nov 05, 2022, 12:33 PM
If you look at the tapestry, you will see a caption "Hic Haroldus rex interfectus est" — "here king Harold is killed". Under "Haroldus" is a man with an arrow in the eye. But a contemporary source (William of Poitiers, if I remember correctly) says that Harold was cut down with a sword and that is depicted under "interfectus est".

Indeed, but the interpretation of the Tapestry and how it fits with the written sources is rather more convuluted as a whole.  The article actually covers this very well, even if I would have come to a slightly different conclusion.
Title: Re: That's one in the eye for Harold (or is it?)
Post by: Nick Harbud on Nov 05, 2022, 04:37 PM
When contemplating possible cause of death, it is important to remember that Harold, if not King, was at least a leading nobleman. 

It would not do to have such an exceptional individual die in a common manner.

:P